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Interface issues

Posted: Fri Jan 05, 2018 10:39 pm
by mpro31
I've been playing with your demo version for quite some time and I'm really impressed by the render engine and the general minimal concept of the program. :P Though I find that some things in user interface somehow draft for intensive use. For example, the scene panel needs a few more steps for improvement to be really usable. Materials and object relation should be improved. Also a node editor would make things simpler. I hope you didn't bother from my criticism. I'll be tuned for future releases.

Re: Interface issues

Posted: Sun Jan 07, 2018 2:25 am
by Originalplan®
Hey mpro31! Welcome & glad you like Indigo.
I believe UI is one of those subjects that can't be 100% perfect for every user.. but it will get better and evolved over time.

Feedback & suggestions are ofc welcomed!
What 3d App do you use Indigo with mostly?

Re: Interface issues

Posted: Tue Jan 09, 2018 5:13 am
by mpro31
thank you very much for the reply, I'm using cinema 4d as a bridge between rhino and indigo. I was referring to the standalone version about the UI issues. I'm currently comparing indigo to octane to which I'm a subscriber. A subscription model and a bidirectional gpu function would made the transition immediate. I'll stay tuned for your updates. thanks again.

Re: Interface issues

Posted: Tue Jan 09, 2018 8:29 am
by Originalplan®
I see.. well I'm sure there will be still some UI refinements done in standalone also down the line.
As for the subscription thing, that's something someone other than me can shad a light on.
Personally I'm not a big fan of subscriptions.... but that's just me.

But hey we love to have you here in the community of Indigo so feel free to post suggestion and questions any time you feel like it. : )

Re: Interface issues

Posted: Sat Jan 20, 2018 9:29 am
by TonyD
+1 on a Node Editor.

Octane's node editor is a feature that basically allows you to tweak elements of a scene in a visual format, like a top-down map of the pieces of the scene.

But what it allows you to do, is to change the geometry of a scene in the standalone renderer itself, without needing to mod the scene in the underlying 3D app.

This creates a lot of nifty workflows, and could be the bridge to features that don't exist yet in the Indigo workflow, such as timeline navigation.

So, for example, in Indigo renderer standalone:
- if I render a still scene, I cannot currently replace the "1-frame"/still geometry, with an animated geometry in a timeline.

Now, imagine you could do that, get the scene elements down as far as materials, and then later bring in an altered geometry with animation via a node editor, without needing to set up the whole entire scene in the underlying 3d application. Would be a tremendous time saver. You could re-use a scene set up over and over with different animated versions of the geometry.

Re: Interface issues

Posted: Sat Jan 20, 2018 11:11 am
by Oscar J
^ Hmm, why would you not want to use your 3d app for these things though?

Re: Interface issues

Posted: Sat Jan 20, 2018 5:07 pm
by TonyD
Oscar J wrote: ↑
Sat Jan 20, 2018 11:11 am
^ Hmm, why would you not want to use your 3d app for these things though?
You avoid needing to do the work again. So, less work + faster.
That's what makes a node editor so powerful, you don't have to go back to the 3D app and do it all over again.
Just upload the new mesh file into the node editor and your scene is already there, ready to receive it in.
To me, the standalone is more powerful than the plugins, and offers the premiere UI experience for Indigo, so I would love to navigate a scene inside of Indigo standalone.

It is along the same lines of changing materials. Imagine you needed to go back to the 3D app every time you needed to change a material, that would be very time consuming. So here, thought is having that same efficiency on the mesh end as well.

Re: Interface issues

Posted: Sat Jan 20, 2018 10:07 pm
by pixie
The path octane was taken was to integrate into 3d apps, for me the less back and forward the better, if you don't have to learn another application even better still! :)

Re: Interface issues

Posted: Sun Jan 21, 2018 1:32 am
by Oscar J
^ Agreed. Personally, I think more powerful plugins are the way forward, rather than trying to turn the standalone into a full fledged scene editing and assembly software (which all 3D software would do a much better job at anyway).

Octane is an interesting example in that some of their plugins are pretty bad, for example their Max/Maya ones. For that reason, some users prefer to export everything to standalone (which has a pretty great UI, to compensate), but this is hardly an optimal workflow. Which might be why they're losing marketshare to more streamlined software such as Redshift and F-storm.

"You avoid needing to do the work again. So, less work + faster. [...]you don't have to go back to the 3D app and do it all over again."

I agree with the sentiment, though for me the key is never having to leave the 3D app in the first place. Just my two cents. :)

Re: Interface issues

Posted: Sun Jan 21, 2018 4:48 pm
by TonyD
Indigo's render engine gives life to scenes in ways that Octane just hasn't been able to achieve, not sure the technical reason, but my eyes just see it overall. So I can't help but imagine that some added user interface tools would really be exciting to have in Indigo standalone! For me, I guess, not having the node editor is not an issue, but something I would enjoy using.

I think in Octane's case the development of the standalone has far surpassed that of the plugins. They are completely in the wake of the standalone and never fully capture the full rage of features, or ease of use. Yet, this does not diminish the value of the plugin to a user who favors the plugin workflow.

Thus, I definitely see value in devoting more resources to the Indigo plugins as that paradigm is beneficial to an application-based workflow. Even when our own defined optimum workflows are varied, we seek the same end goal.

Kind of like some people want to see iOS be more like Android, and then others want Android to be more like iOS...
And what we find, everyone wants a more feature rich tablet :P