[REQ] Light Priority

[pixie]

Now the ligh relevance is according to it's power, which can be at times a bit cumbersome, my suggestion was to add a 0-10 value so that the priority for that light is set. Amiga task schedular had something of the like, if you gave 10 tasks the same value, they would have the same amount of time computed, if you happen to given half that value only half of the time.
It would be nice to stop a given light contribution and focus on others.

[CTZn]

It would be nice to stop a given light contribution and focus on others.

Relates with http://www.indigorenderer.com/forum/vie ... php?t=4794

I think your request, and mine by the way, are a bit shy. Granted, yours is layer-independent. I'd rather see an automatized normalization based on an estimator over splatted samples.

In other words, Indigo would scale the powers automatically so all lights would contribute by the same amount to the rendered image. Pausing/throttling lights would then become irrelevant. Layers would not be used to conceal the noisy lamps.

Hoping I'm making sense.

I assume it's no easy task also; say, if a glossy transparent is partially masking the incoming rays from a lamp (local discrepancies), then this lamp may result overpowered overall. Pausing/throttling is probably more of a reasonable option for now ?

[pixie]

It would be nice to stop a given light contribution and focus on others.

Relates with http://www.indigorenderer.com/forum/vie ... php?t=4794

I think your request, and mine by the way, are a bit shy. Granted, yours is layer-independent. I'd rather see an automatized normalization based on an estimator over splatted samples.

In other words, Indigo would scale the powers automatically so all lights would contribute by the same amount to the rendered image. Pausing/throttling lights would then become irrelevant. Layers would not be used to conceal the noisy lamps.

Hoping I'm making sense.

I assume it's no easy task also; say, if a glossy transparent is partially masking the incoming rays from a lamp (local discrepancies), then this lamp may result overpowered overall. Pausing/throttling is probably more of a reasonable option for now ?

Indeed, a pausing/throttling switch would also fit this very well!

[lycium]

We've considered a feature like this several times in the past, and while it can be very useful in experienced hands, there's unfortunately also plenty of scope for less experienced users to make their rendering extremely inefficient with such a feature.

For example, we already run into situations where users will take a light layer gain from 1 to 10, meaning the light gets under-sampled by a factor of 10 relative to its final brightness. You could exploit this by manually scaling the brightness of various lights and then adjusting in the light layers, but this is somewhat cumbersome...

[StompinTom]

We've considered a feature like this several times in the past, and while it can be very useful in experienced hands, there's unfortunately also plenty of scope for less experienced users to make their rendering extremely inefficient with such a feature.

For example, we already run into situations where users will take a light layer gain from 1 to 10, meaning the light gets under-sampled by a factor of 10 relative to its final brightness. You could exploit this by manually scaling the brightness of various lights and then adjusting in the light layers, but this is somewhat cumbersome...

I constantly have the 'start rendering, jack up light levels, quit, adjust lights in Blender, start rendering, tweak light levels, quit...' syndrome Once/if Indigo can get integrated within Blender, I'm sure that will be much more streamlined.

[CTZn]

We've considered a feature like this several times in the past, and while it can be very useful in experienced hands, there's unfortunately also plenty of scope for less experienced users to make their rendering extremely inefficient with such a feature.

*Pompous advocacy warning*

Glare Technologies has been doing a truely fantastic work in terms of software performances, I'm saying this with much evidences. Thanks to artists like StompinTom among many.

I have no right to direct anyone down here, but I am entitled to request more awesomness for those who can harness a powerfull beast.

Of course there is the matter of the renderer integration wich is probably a valuable argument enough to forget about that notorious syndrome wich Tom depicted.

But there's also the matter of education. It has just started. I believe that it is the right thing to get anyone up, granted the motivation that the works above will definitely inspire.

Now that's embarrassing, because GT is a small team really, essentially dedicated to what it does best (special mention to the promising video tutorials lycium presented though). Also embarrassing from me, a living example of counter-productivity I recon Embarrassing from me again because that point of view might be mine only; that's the kind of thing I can endorse (my untimely integrity, you know).

But education is the vehicule of knowledge, and knowledge the condition to the righteous actions. The righteous ways to harness a true beast, as opposed to the kitten Indigo can not be anyways.

However, since that can most also can least, it remains possible to dumb down features provided that this would be an optional move.

For the sake of awesomness, word.

In no case would I ask for the silly, though I may be able to show otherwise. You tell me As much as this can be about orientation, it's not about hurry.

Your truely.

[lycium]

Better would be, if Indigo simply did a better job in the first place. Nick's been working on some great core improvements, to be continued after 3.2 Stable's out

[pixie]

Popquiz
Here we have three light layer applied to the scene.

Which of the scenes presented (left|right) has:
a) rendered for longer period of time
b) even light strength applied to it

updated: grammar issues

[CTZn]

Popquiz
Here we have three light layer applied to the scene.

popquiz.jpg

Which of the scenes presented (left|right) has:
a) rendered for long time
b) uneven light strengths applied to it

I know I know, red is weaker !!!


Wait, what was the question ?

[Zom-B]

Lovly quiz pixie, you nailed it

We've considered a feature like this several times in the past, and while it can be very useful in experienced hands, there's unfortunately also plenty of scope for less experienced users to make their rendering extremely inefficient with such a feature.

There may be customers who uses Indigo for work who could run with forks & torches after you for such comments ^^
Why is the user that knows about that "situation" less worth then a total n00b who just plays around with the software???

[OnoSendai]

Hi Guys,
Let me put it this way:
We will either implement a light priority feature, or fix Indigo so that it's not necessary at all.

[pixie]

Whereas on my previous quiz it was all too simple, namely as both questions shared the same answer my next quiz will be a bit harder.

These three pictures makes two set of pairs, which each share the same attribute. Which pair is which, and which attributes would those be.

[pixie]

Popquiz
Here we have three light layer applied to the scene.

popquiz.jpg

Which of the scenes presented (left|right) has:
a) rendered for long time
b) uneven light strengths applied to it

I know I know, red is weaker !!!


Wait, what was the question ?

Well, in both scenes we have that Red is weaker then Green is weaker then Blue by a 1:100 ratio.
And both have been rendered with the same amount of time (3m), so how can we have the right image so much cleaner then left?
Whereas on the left I left Indigo do it's stuff, on right I rendered each pass separate for 1 minute, merging them thereafter.

[CTZn]

Hi Guys,
Let me put it this way:
We will either implement a light priority feature, or fix Indigo so that it's not necessary at all.

This way helps understanding better, thanks !

Why is the user that knows about that "situation" less worth then a total n00b who just plays around with the software???

Besides, Indigo is simple enough already.

It's not a complex thing, though not a random one either to set relevant material parameters. You got to have an idea of the real thing (use references in addition to just textures !), the schemes themselves are rather intuitive.

@pixie: Sound, gold trick thank you ! http://www.indigorenderer.com/forum/vie ... 29#p114429

[pixie]

easy way: set 'Light Normalization' on in indigo for cinema 4d, and set each and every light to the same amount of lumen,apply different layers to different groups, and in indigo set the relative power to your taste. It works like a charm.