External or Internal Texture Maps?

[Whaat]

Please post your opinion on whether you would like to keep the current material editor scheme of using 'in-model' SketchUp textures for all of your maps or if you would like to use the more typical 'external textures' method, where you define a texture by an external path (not an internal SketchUp material).

Both methods have their advantages and disadvantages but I am curious to hear your thoughts and preferences.

[aslocum]

with externel method you mean something like maxwells approach with assigning(well more linking than assigning) a maxwell-mxm to a mat in sktechup?

i really like the behaviour like it is now.

[kwistenbiebel]

Internal for me.
The only thing that might benefit from change in material setup would be the way to assign multiple uv-sets (diffuse,bump,etc...).? I wouldn't know how though. It is actually an issue all render engines struggle with.
The most WYSIWYG system wins imho.

The ultimate solution would be that Sketchup would support multiple material slots by default. Probably never going to happen.

[eulgrand]

The most WYSIWYG system wins imho.

Same for me. Personnaly, the more I can do within SketchUp, the better.

[Whaat]

ok.

There is some apparent confusion here. What I am proposing to do is change the way bump maps, exponent maps, displacement maps, etc. are selected.

Currently, you have to select from a drop-down list and your choices can only be textures that are currently 'in your model'. This is what I mean by 'internal textures'

By 'external textures' I mean that you could use textures that are not 'in your model'. This is how most apps work. You select the texture you want by browsing for the texture path.

I am not talking about 'linked materials' (such as linked MXM or linked IGM). SkIndigo will remain WYSIWYG.

Here are the advantages and disadvantages as I see them:

External Textures
Advantages:
- SketchUp model file size stays smaller
- More common workflow with other apps
- Potentially less confusing to new users
- Textures do not get lost when user changes material names or purges unused SketchUp materials.

Internal (in model) Textures
Advantages:
- Portabilility. SketchUp scene files can be shared between computers without breaking the map links.
- RGB control. Internal textures allow you to use SkechUp to easily tweak the RGB and HSV of all of your maps
- Works easier with standard SketchUp materials (SKM files).
- Familiar workflow to past SkIndigo users.

Am I forgetting anything?

[aslocum]

how will the external files uv mapped and sized?
otherwise.. ok this has advantages over internal (especially the purge thing )
maybe implement both.. ? one thing is still in.. just add other option for it?

[cpfresh]

i guess if i understood how you plan to deal with the mapping part of it then i could better vote. right now i hate when some textures get purged because they are not actually used in the model (or so sketchup thinks) that would be one big plus for me. but mapping ... how would it go?

[Whaat]

how will the external files uv mapped and sized?
otherwise.. ok this has advantages over internal (especially the purge thing )
maybe implement both.. ? one thing is still in.. just add other option for it?

yeah...I might try and implement them both if it isn't too confusing.

As far as UV mapping goes, by default, the texture will map to the same UVs as the texture that is applied to the faces in SketchUp. So...you still need a texture applied to the faces so the correct UVs will be exported to Indigo.

You can also use saved UV sets to position the texture if you don't want a texture applied to your SketchUp model.

[aslocum]

just the dropdownbox as it is currently and as option in the dropdown box "... from file " click will open file dialog? something like that. seems intuitive for me

[Stinkie]

I'd have to choose for external maps. With internal maps, using high-res textures lead to pretty hefty filesizes pretty quickly.

[kwistenbiebel]

Whaat, after your explanation I would go for external as well.
As for having multiple uv-sets for external textures, that remains tricky.

[pugz1983]

I Like the Kerkythea approach. I'm working on a basic laptop at this moment and the SU file size is a problem for me.

[aslocum]

I Like the Kerkythea approach. I'm working on a basic laptop at this moment and the SU file size is a problem for me.

thats excactly what i DONT like. assigning all (render)materials outside sketchup. but thats thankfully not the approach skindigo (and indigo in general...there is no "indigo-studio") will go (and really hope so for the future).

[cpfresh]

... so instead of mapping a large hi-def image (and consequently bringing SU to a grinding halt) we load and map a smaller place-holder image which is only used for UV coordinates and replaced in the final render with the larger texture. i guess that sounds cool, but won't the place-holder image still be purged by SU during clean-up? perhaps by that time it's ok because the coordinates have already been saved? as we've seen previously, the proxy feature has been very very handy, why wouldn't we feel the same about proxy textures? i vote external. let's try it out.

[Whaat]

... so instead of mapping a large hi-def image (and consequently bringing SU to a grinding halt) we load and map a smaller place-holder image which is only used for UV coordinates and replaced in the final render with the larger texture. i guess that sounds cool, but won't the place-holder image still be purged by SU during clean-up? perhaps by that time it's ok because the coordinates have already been saved? as we've seen previously, the proxy feature has been very very handy, why wouldn't we feel the same about proxy textures? i vote external. let's try it out.

That's right cpfresh. When using an external texture, the SU texture would be used only for UV mapping.

Thanks for the feedback! I think what I will do is create three texture types that are selected by a drop-down menu: SketchUp, External, or Custom Shader. (I may add preset shaders later such as fractal, noise, checker, etc.)

If you have SketchUp selected, SkIndigo will use the map applied to the current SU material for the given attribute (albedo, bump, exponent). Pressing the '..' button allows you to edit the advanced texture attributes

If you have External selected, you can then select the path to the external texture by clicking the '..' button. The '..' button also allows editing of the advanced texture attributes. The external texture will then be used in the render.

If you have Custom Shader selected, pressing the '..' button allows you to edit the shader code.

I think the method described above is pretty intuitive (which is very important to me) and provides the most versatile functionality. A downside of this change is that your old scenes will not be compatible with the new SkIndigo version (you would have to re-apply all of your textures)Any thoughts?