SkIndigo 3.0.14 (3.0 Stable)

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CTZn
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Re: SkIndigo 3.0.14 (3.0 Stable)

Post by CTZn » Wed Aug 03, 2011 4:34 pm

Pibuz wrote:If you want to have smooth emitters, always split them into separate layers, give them absurd powers and then push them down through the light layers' panel during the rendering.

Got it?
Maybe I sounded like I took Pibuz words but I just wanted to insist on the balancing stage, it's true that the powers may end to be absurd but they should not be random for the matter.

It is true also that the fact is not known well enough and that it is nonetheless a major tweaking stage in optimizing renders.
Pibuz wrote:I've written this a million times, I think... :?

Indigo assigns the calculation power according to the emitters' power. So if you compare a standard emitter and the sun, you'll have a perfectly smooth sun and a very noisy emitter (since the sun is much more powerful than a 50W lightbulb).
IDK how Glare Technologies is willing to communicate on the topic.

Sorry for interfering in the discussion Pibuz, I meant to help but not to be rude. Are we even now ? I'm lost, I feel like I was punished well :mrgreen:
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Re: SkIndigo 3.0.14 (3.0 Stable)

Post by Pibuz » Wed Aug 03, 2011 7:40 pm

Don't worry CTZn! :lol:
I'm not mad at you: only busy at work! :lol:

..actually, your explainations are usually much more technical than the average SU user can understand. But it's also true that we never stop learning, so... what is emission scale and how can we use it? I remember to have read something like that using SkIndigo, but I didn't know how to fiddle with that :oops:
Should be helpful to know! 8)

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Re: SkIndigo 3.0.14 (3.0 Stable)

Post by CTZn » Wed Aug 03, 2011 8:26 pm

What a relief Pibuz, thank you for the pointer. I am trying to be helpfull but that also is a learning process, you should never fear to teach me a thing or two :)

Well I know only the very basics of what's beneath the discussion, therefore I am definitely opting for a pragmatic, perceptual resolution, until the process get automatized.

I would like to know wether it will, or why not...

Back to my little knowledge. As far as I know, a light source is caracterised by the power of it's photons (rays in our case) and the rate at wich they are produced. What I don't get is how these two parameters are linked under the sole emission scale in Indigo (in optics, generally).

In all cases, and by my own experience, in Indigo the scale emission is driving both the energy of emitted rays and their rate (flux). You get local noise obviously when one light source is emitting at a lower rate than others.

As I told, the method I know to even rates is visual; if a light source seems to emit half the rays than another you need to multiply it's emission scale by two (or lower the other one by the same amount). If an environment is used then it should preferably be the reference luminaire to wich you would match rates to.

So while evening rates you will indeed find yourself with absurd values and that's where the layers gain cames in handy.

The base unit for emission scale is the lumen, and other units are mostly build around that one. Check down that page http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luminous_flux for more details, also some of the paragraphs there may give users more clues about what we are talking about (or not ;)).
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Re: SkIndigo 3.0.14 (3.0 Stable)

Post by Pibuz » Wed Aug 03, 2011 9:07 pm

My method is purely visual too CTZn!
..I don't understand if the "emission scale" you're referring to is an Indigo variable or just a term for us to understand what we're talking about :lol:

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Re: SkIndigo 3.0.14 (3.0 Stable)

Post by CTZn » Wed Aug 03, 2011 10:12 pm

Emission scale is an Indigo term, as per the Indigo Technical Reference shipping with the application, page 97:
emission_scale
Scales the amount of light emitted by a certain material as applied to the current model, according to one of
several different photometric measures.
I take it that SkIndigo is using a more fluent naming !
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Re: SkIndigo 3.0.14 (3.0 Stable)

Post by Pibuz » Wed Aug 03, 2011 10:21 pm

Take it that I'm no expert: maybe SkIndigo has it, and I don't know!
I'm gonna check that! Thanks!

So basically you say: "don't push up efficiency and power, try to adjust the emission scale instead! Then you'll have to adjust things with light layers, but you fiddle with less variables inside SkIndigo".

Is that right?

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Re: SkIndigo 3.0.14 (3.0 Stable)

Post by CTZn » Thu Aug 04, 2011 12:16 am

Just use power and let efficacy fixed. Emission scale is in fact a more recent implementation but the results in terms of flux control are the same I guess.

Here's what Whaat told me when I was trying myself to understand how to implement Emission Scale:
Whaat wrote:in SkIndigo, the emission scale settings are in the material editor dialog and I plan to keep it this way as it seems more intuitive.
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Re: SkIndigo 3.0.14 (3.0 Stable)

Post by Pibuz » Thu Aug 04, 2011 12:19 am

Very good. I'll make some tests and see what happens. Thanks CTZn!

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Re: SkIndigo 3.0.14 (3.0 Stable)

Post by CTZn » Thu Aug 04, 2011 12:52 am

I'll install SkIndigo myself to close the gap. Thanks for your time Pibuz !
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Re: SkIndigo 3.0.14 (3.0 Stable)

Post by Whaat » Thu Aug 04, 2011 9:22 am

Next version of SkIndigo will finally have a full proper implementation of Indigo's emission scale. So no more power and efficacy. It will be set in lumen, candela, nit, or lux.

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Re: SkIndigo 3.0.14 (3.0 Stable)

Post by Pibuz » Thu Aug 04, 2011 10:24 am

..any spoilers of other awesomenesses included?

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Re: SkIndigo 3.0.14 (3.0 Stable)

Post by CTZn » Thu Aug 04, 2011 10:34 am

oh blunder :mrgreen:
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Re: SkIndigo 3.0.14 (3.0 Stable)

Post by Whaat » Fri Aug 05, 2011 3:07 am

Pibuz wrote:..any spoilers of other awesomenesses included?
- Sun and environment maps in same render
- External meshes

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Re: SkIndigo 3.0.14 (3.0 Stable)

Post by snorky » Fri Aug 05, 2011 3:34 am

Whaat wrote:- Sun and environment maps in same render
- External meshes
Whaat wrote:Next version of SkIndigo will finally have a full proper implementation of Indigo's emission scale. So no more power and efficacy. It will be set in lumen, candela, nit, or lux.
:mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

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Re: SkIndigo 3.0.14 (3.0 Stable)

Post by Pibuz » Fri Aug 05, 2011 3:50 am

I already use external meshes :mrgreen:

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